Open Source
- crosire
- Topic Author
Pro
- I have very little time to continue the project, so open sourcing it might help in speeding up development via contribution on GitHub.
- ReShade implements some very interesting concepts that would surely be interesting for some people (depending on the licensing model).
- All built-in anti-exploitation routines are rendered useless, since it's easy to remove them from the code and rebuild.
- The base could be misused for creating cheat tools since it allows deep integration into game code with little effort.
- Both of these could reflect bad on ReShade itself and might get the tool banned from online games entirely (which in the moment is just a gray zone)
- I'm obviously afraid of code stealing, since A LOT of my time and passion went into this project. I haven't seen such issues with my other open source projects, so I'm confident it's not going to be a problem, but still worth mentioning.
The contra arguments could partially be solved by providing signed binaries for download. However, software certificates are ridiculously expensive so I cannot afford doing that.
If I missed any arguments, please point them out in a reply! Thank you.
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- FierySwordswoman
The only thing I can think of that might make it more feasible is the adding of support for new graphic API's (d3d12 and vulkan at the moment).
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- Mobeeuz
Is there someone the torch could be passed to instead?
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- FierySwordswoman
Mobeeuz wrote: It's Crosire's baby, it's his call.
Aye. I'm pretty sure Crosire doesn't like the idea of it. As they're the project's creator, I think that's pretty much enough argument in itself.
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- ShoterXX
Also, a potential really negative point that was not mentioned: malicious versions. While it won't affect the official branch, other people may start spreading "custom ReShade versions" which may contain harmful code bundled in.
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- NoMansReshade
But thank you, Crosire for even considering the idea!!!
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- BlueSkyKnight
The main problem as you pointed out is "code stealing." This is real issue to me. This something that I don't think you can get around if you open up your software. I don't think you have to worry about the small coder stealing your work. I think you would have to worry about a software company stealing code.
But, at the same time OMG I hate cheaters................................................... There are so many Tools that allow cheating as it is. I don't think allowing one more tool would Hurt as much as we think.
To me human nature dictates that there will always be cheaters. This is a video on trying to understand why people cheat.
I say sacrificing our multiplayer experience for a excellent single player experience. Is a acceptable loss. How do you people feel about this?
In the end It's still your call Crosire. You should only do this if you feel it's right to do so.
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- NoMansReshade
Take Unreal Engine 4 for example. Every single update is jam-packed full of features and fixes purely because there are over 200 contributers actively working on the project. Unreal Engine 4 is very successful, so take this argument with a grain of salt. You could even go the same route EpicGames did, and just have a "Coding Standard" and have trusted members monitor every contribution. Yes the source could be used for bad, but as @BlueSkyKnight said: "I don't think allowing one more tool would Hurt as much as we think."
But at the end of the day, Reshade is @Crosire's project, and he can do with it as he pleases, and we should all respect that decision!!!
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- Sh1nRa358
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- JBeckman
Also potentially helps with development speed and finding bugs and other things to improve on if more people have access to the source code directly, possibly even D3D12 and Vulkan API support or other enhancements.
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- FierySwordswoman
Sh1nRa358 wrote: Ppl who use cheat codes still do so even if this didn't exist.
JBeckman wrote: ...I doubt ReShade would be used much when there's other utilities for this purpose specifically so I don't see any risks there.
It's not that we're worried it's going to cause some super huge spur of cheating by being the next Scripthook. It obviously won't.
The problem is that companies could start banning people who use ReShade if it's easy to cheat with it. As far as I've tried, you can currently use ReShade in any multiplayer game it can inject into without consequence.
That'd be a massive loss if the risks come to fruition.
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- Martigen
This.FierySwordswoman wrote: The problem is that companies could start banning people who use ReShade if it's easy to cheat with it. As far as I've tried, you can currently use ReShade in any multiplayer game it can inject into without consequence.
That'd be a massive loss if the risks come to fruition.
And to add my 5c:
To those not thinking it will have much effect on cheating -- Reshade can be used with its depth-buffer to make wall-hacks for pretty any game now and in the future. You won't know someone else is using it. In time, companies *will* detect and ban Reshade hooks, and gone will be the ability to customise any online game to any degree. Dunno about you, but there's not a single game I don't use Reshade with. I'd hate to one day be unable to use it in some of my favourite games.
And -- you can't get put the cat back in the bag. Once one cheating fork is made, it will spread like wildfire and we will never be able to get back to where we are now where Reshade is not considered a cheat. This is a one way door. You don't need a crystal ball to predict this will happen with 100% certainty -- as another posted said, there will always be cheaters -- and they will use any and all tools at their disposal to cheat.
I think, as was also raised above, a better solution might be to entrust code access to a few programmers able to assist Crosire in continuing development. In fact -- to some degree, you probably do need a business continuity plan anyway Crosire. If for whatever reason you can no longer work on Reshade, it will also be sad to see it die, and so at some point access given to one or more individuals should be considered in advance.
As for the signed binaries -- put up a donation page Crosire with that clear purpose. Pretty sure you'll make enough to afford licenses quick smart
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- BlueSkyKnight
Martigen wrote:
This.FierySwordswoman wrote: The problem is that companies could start banning people who use ReShade if it's easy to cheat with it. As far as I've tried, you can currently use ReShade in any multiplayer game it can inject into without consequence.
That'd be a massive loss if the risks come to fruition.
And to add my 5c:
To those not thinking it will have much effect on cheating -- Reshade can be used with its depth-buffer to make wall-hacks for pretty any game now and in the future. You won't know someone else is using it. In time, companies *will* detect and ban Reshade hooks, and gone will be the ability to customise any online game to any degree. Dunno about you, but there's not a single game I don't use Reshade with. I'd hate to one day be unable to use it in some of my favourite games.
And -- you can't get put the cat back in the bag. Once one cheating fork is made, it will spread like wildfire and we will never be able to get back to where we are now where Reshade is not considered a cheat. This is a one way door. You don't need a crystal ball to predict this will happen with 100% certainty -- as another posted said, there will always be cheaters -- and they will use any and all tools at their disposal to cheat.
I think, as was also raised above, a better solution might be to entrust code access to a few programmers able to assist Crosire in continuing development. In fact -- to some degree, you probably do need a business continuity plan anyway Crosire. If for whatever reason you can no longer work on Reshade, it will also be sad to see it die, and so at some point access given to one or more individuals should be considered in advance.
As for the signed binaries -- put up a donation page Crosire with that clear purpose. Pretty sure you'll make enough to afford licenses quick smart
You use Reshade in all your online games?
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- Sunesha
That's why I chose to vote no.
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- Sh1nRa358
Saying no will set gamer progress backward and also slow down the 3dvision community even more. And if this was used for cheating, the coder would change the name of the process or the name of the program anyway. Anti-cheat things go by file name just like virus scanners. It can't block what they don't have on file to block.
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- helifax
I want to thank you again with helping me use Reshade in my 3DVision OpenGL wrapper. Making the wrapper open source is not a problem. There are lots of others wrappers/hookers out there for OpenGL/DirectX that could be used for cheating and that are Open Source. 3DMigoto for example is fully on GitHub, an older version of my wrapper is also on GitHub and countless others. Yet, none of them have been used for cheating in any game, to my knowledge.
People who go to the extent to cheat in games using wrappers, most likely already wrote their own wrappers/programs for this purpose and there is no need to re-purpose Reshade.
I am all pro for the Open Source movement. However, if you have code that you don't want to share for different reasons;) How about making an "Open Source" version of the wrapper not containing these pieces of code;) This is what I ended up doing with my wrapper:)
The main advantage of being Open Sourced is you will definitely find people interested in the code. They can add new features to the wrapper or even enrich the current engine;)
Cheers!
Helifax
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- zig11727
I will also donate for signed code.
Thanks,
zig11727
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- NoMansReshade
But unfortunately the people have spoken
EDIT:
Is there an official reshade discord?? If not, I think it would be cool to have one
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- Martigen
Yes, I do Though I mostly play NS2 -- my profile here: sfx.thelazy.net/games/preset/1754/BlueSkyKnight wrote: You use Reshade in all your online games?
(note it's old, pre-Reshade UI etc, been playing with it that long)
You seem to think cheaters have morals... they're cheaters, they have none. And they will certainly put personal gain over 'the master race'.Sh1nRa358 wrote: I highly doubt ppl will give up their right to make the game look pretty in order to cheat. master race is greater than that xD
[just cutting short the quote for reference, but it all applies]helifax wrote: Hi crosire,
I want to thank you again with helping me use Reshade in my 3DVision OpenGL wrapper. Making the wrapper open source is not a problem. There are lots of others wrappers/hookers out there for OpenGL/DirectX that could be used for cheating and that are Open Source. 3DMigoto for example is fully on GitHub, an older version of my wrapper is also on GitHub and countless others. Yet, none of them have been used for cheating in any game, to my knowledge.
...
I must admit, despite my initial opposition, helifax's post changes my mind somewhat.
And this is also valid. In a year or two, all games will be DX12/Vulcan and unless Reshade gets support it will be lost by the wayside. That thought terrifies mezig11727 wrote: It would be nice to open source the project there is a lot of talent in 3D Vision community this could result in making the reshade work with DX12 and Vulcan
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Tools for bypassing its protection has existed already, and i used them myself, ingames i knew i would do no harm (TrackMania for instance).
Code thiefs and cheaters are everywhere, there's no stopping them, however, i think its worth making ReShade open source in favor of progress, even with the risks, i know that there's people with lots of potential to help, and im pretty sure they will.
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